There may be errors in spelling, grammar, and accuracy in this machine-generated transcript.
Nancy McClelland: Welcome to. She counts, the Real Talk podcast for women in accounting with your hosts, Nancy McClelland and Telka. And every episode, we're digging into the real experiences, challenges, and unspoken truths of life in this profession.
Questian Telka: Because if you've ever felt like you're the only one, you're not. And you shouldn't have to figure it out alone. [00:00:30]
Nancy McClelland: Special thanks to our sponsors forwardly, Justine, Lackey and Keeper. We are so grateful to them for helping us bring these conversations to life, enabling us to share out loud what everyone's thinking but no one's saying. Learn more about them on our sponsors page at ESOP.
Questian Telka: Today's episode is called Amplifying Women Who Count the Wave of Women's Conferences shaping Accounting. And [00:01:00] if you guys are watching us on video, you'll notice that we have not one but three special total powerhouse women joining us today. Each one of these women are redefining the accounting conference scene. Sharon Fuller is the chair of Afa's Women Who Count. Aaron Kohan is the creator of Wave Conference. And Madeline Reeves founded Advisory Amplified with her company, Fearless Foundry.
Nancy McClelland: Welcome [00:01:30] to the show, ladies. We would love for each of you to give our audience a short intro. Just tell us who you are, the name of your firm, and one thing that you'd like listeners to know about you. Let's start with Aaron, our moderator for an upcoming She Counts episode sneak peek. I [00:02:00] love that. That's so perfect. Thank you. You already nailed the entire point of this. Um, welcome to the show, Erin. Thank you for being here. And next, Sharrin.
Sharrin Fuller: Erin to Sharrin. Love it. Sharrin Fuller I am, um, I have glass wall adventures, and I specialize in working with accounting firm owners on how to scale and prepare their business for exit. And, [00:02:30] um, something to know is, um, I this is trademarked, but sometimes you have to scale down to scale up. Um.
Nancy McClelland: I love that.
Sharrin Fuller: I'm not his, you know, um, empathetic on my on my thing is Aaron. But that's okay. She took.
Nancy McClelland: It.
Sharrin Fuller: I love it.
Questian Telka: Can I share something that you forgot to mention, by the way?
Sharrin Fuller: Yeah. Yes.
Questian Telka: You have something big happening at And Intuit connect, right? Or right before Intuit Connect.
Sharrin Fuller: I.Do.
Questian Telka: Can we share [00:03:00] that? Are we allowed? Yeah.
Sharrin Fuller: By the time. Yeah, sure. Why not? You can.
Questian Telka: Share it.
Sharrin Fuller: I don't have.
Questian Telka: A book coming out.
Sharrin Fuller: I do, I wrote a book, it's called Unfollow the Rules and I'm really super crazy excited about it. It's weird that it's a real thing. So. Yes. Hey, thanks for that.
Nancy McClelland: I can't wait to read it. Can't wait.
Sharrin Fuller: Thank you.
Nancy McClelland: Madeleine. Madeleine, tell us about yourself.
Sharrin Fuller: Yeah.
Madeline Reeves: Hi. I'm so excited to be here with you all. I'm Madeleine Reeves, I'm the founder and CEO of Fearless Foundry, and I'm just [00:03:30] across the water from Aaron. So I live on a small island called Bainbridge Island. And I would say that, like, the thing I want to share today is that you never know what can happen if community comes together. And I just think conversations like this are such a testament to that. And all of the events that we're creating are such a testament to this community as well. So I'm really excited to dig into some conversation about the power of community today.
Questian Telka: Yeah, I love it. Are we very excited.
Nancy McClelland: So much for being here, everyone. We're thrilled to have you.
Questian Telka: As [00:04:00] everyone knows, we like to launch every episode with a story. And today, Nancy and I have a story about the first time that we actually met in person. And interestingly enough, it was at an all women's bookkeeping and accounting retreat hosted by Cindy Schroeder of Bookkeeping Buds. And so I want to ask Nancy, because that was my actual first conference after I started my business. It was the first time I went to a conference or.
Nancy McClelland: Any conference of any kind.
Questian Telka: Well, [00:04:30] in accounting. Yeah, right. So that's why after I started. Yeah, exactly.
Nancy McClelland: I don't think I knew that. That's great.
Questian Telka: Well, now you do. I guess we still learn things about each other that we didn't already know every once in a while. But I wanted to ask you, Nancy. You had been conferencing for a long time already, so this was definitely not your first conference. Tell me, what about this female led retreat stood out to you. Why did you choose to continue to, you know, go to a smaller retreat when there are all these other [00:05:00] conferences happening at the same time?
Nancy McClelland: That is a great question. And I think I have a great answer, which is that one of the things that's really special about bookkeeping buds and Cindy Schroeder and and really, I am going to extend this to all of the women that I know in accounting, is that, um, the focus on community bonding, connection and helping each other. For example, there were sessions at this retreat that we went to on wellness [00:05:30] and confidence and marketing yourself, and there was a sense of safety. Um, we were definitely all in a safe space where we could share our experiences. We could share our fears and our self-doubts, and sharing those things with each other is something that really encourages bonding. And as a smaller Retreat. That one in particular. You know, there's just a lot more time for one on one connection. And when we're connecting with each other, we're creating community [00:06:00] in a very different way than when we're at a conference that has potentially one, two, three, 5000 people. And, um, those connections come in really, really, really handy later in life. Um, for example, you and, um, Dawn slogan at that conference, you know, we ended up all getting together because you guys were doing contracting work for me, and, um, you guys got to meet each other, and we tied closer together as a team. Um, [00:06:30] when you meet people and you have one on one connections at events like this, especially in an all women's space where you feel safe, it means that maybe you won't be embarrassed to reach out when you need help with something later on. As you and I have talked about in lots of the episodes. So it was a very it's a very special retreat. And I'm really glad that, um, I'm glad that that was where we finally got to meet for the first time.
Questian Telka: So am I at the Bookkeeping Buds retreat was also where I saw Carla Caldwell speak, [00:07:00] and seeing a woman in a, you know, running a firm in a position of power teaching me how to do marketing was one of the first times that I decided that I wanted to speak. So having those, um, those topics and conferences and those spaces that are special for women can really create a lot of opportunity and also give us the give us the opportunity to see other women in positions that we want to or imagine ourselves [00:07:30] being in.
Nancy McClelland: Absolutely. Carla is so inspiring. And the Bookkeeping Buds Retreat is a very special conference. But really, every conference is special. Every single conference has something that makes it different than other conferences. And so I want to hear from our guests. Um, I'd love for you to tell us about the conference that you run. What is it? Where is it held? When is it held, the type of content, the method of delivery, and so on. So let's start with Aaron. I want to hear all about [00:08:00] wave.
Erin Pohan: Okay so wave Seattle happened for its first time ever this year. And really it was the idea of bringing women in accounting and finance together. So Wave stands for women in accounting visionaries and entrepreneurs. And so we are women who are running our own firms or doing big things in the accounting industry. And the idea is to come together for collaboration and for growth [00:08:30] and really to just push each other forward for the betterment of our industry. So we are meeting again next May, May 15th, 2026 here in Seattle. And it's going to be great. So we're inviting 100 ladies in. We're already 30% sold out which is wild to me. But we are. It's going to be great.
Nancy McClelland: I already have my ticket, and as a matter of fact, my birthday is two days later, so I will going to be spending a birthday week in Seattle because of this.
Erin Pohan: Yes, [00:09:00] all the birthday celebrations, I love it.
Nancy McClelland: Uh, Sharon, we would love to hear about women who count.
Sharrin Fuller: Absolutely. So women who count is put on by the Afwa, which is the Accounting and Financial Women's Alliance. And it's been around for quite a while. It's taken a little bit of a different direction, um, post Covid, maybe because I got involved and brought the accounting industry in and, um, the first time I went to it was in, I think, 21 in, in Chicago at the Drake. And I thought, this is a really great conference. It has so much potential. [00:09:30] Um, and I've really been I just dumped it, jumped in head first, and I've been involved ever since. And this year is my first year as being the full chair of the whole entire thing. And I cannot tell you the amount of respect I have for anybody that puts on a conference, um, at this point. Let me just say, if you're a speaker attendee, book your hotel room and register like. And that's for every conference ever. But this one's really exciting because it really does. It brings in. It's not I mean, it is women who count. And we're supporting women in the industry. And it is [00:10:00] one of the very first national women's conferences. Everything has been more, you know, um, local and this one's national.
Sharrin Fuller: I think AICPA just created one. And we have everybody from, you know, college students all the way to retirees. And it's really just about the community and coming together. And, um, you know, there's education and such, but we can get the education anywhere nowadays. And so to me, it's more of a we need more than that. When we're together, we need a reason to be together. We [00:10:30] need the support. We need the the, you know, we got each other's back. We need the encouragement. So when we all leave there, we all feel like we can run the country. And that's kind of what the point of it is, is just the community, the networking, the people and just really just lifting each other up in ways that we didn't think were possible. It is coming up here. It's in six weeks. It's October 22nd through 24th in Mesa, Arizona. We are. I'm pretty excited because this will be the biggest one we've had. We're going to have 350 attendees and we have um, [00:11:00] I actually had to add additional sponsorship options for for our sponsors. And we are we're going to our hotels almost sold out. We're going to sell out tickets. So I'm very, very excited about it.
Questian Telka: Congrats.
Nancy McClelland: That is so exciting. And I want to point out, you know, Erin, you said that yours is capped at 100. Sharon. This is capped at 350. So this is you know, these are smaller conferences on the grand scheme of things. So really allowing for a lot of that one on one um that we were [00:11:30] talking about. Now of course, when this episode airs, we're going to be one month out because this episode should be airing on September 24th. So if you're hearing this episode and you want to go to women who count, get on it Today?
Sharrin Fuller: Yes. Absolutely.
Nancy McClelland: Madeleine. We want to hear all about advisory amplified.
Madeline Reeves: Thank you. Yeah. I'm so excited. So we're just a couple weeks out on the first stop of our first of its kind tour that's going to be hitting six cities starting on September 23rd and then traveling to LA, Chicago, [00:12:00] Austin, Atlanta and Boston. And what makes this event pretty unique is that it's really focused on hands on content for firms that are really looking to scale advisory services. I've been in and around the industry for almost 15 years now, and what really surprised me when I kind of went back to conferences was like, oh, we're still kind of having those same convos about like, well, what is advisory as opposed to really showing people what it looks like? And so I've worked really hard to bring together speakers and leaders who are really experienced at scaling [00:12:30] highly profitable advisory services so that we can teach people the how in a really hands on way. Not just talking theory, but really thinking about like, what are the tactical skills you need to learn everything from how to structure and price those services to how to deliver them. And we've got a workbook component that I'm really excited about.
Madeline Reeves: I've been in printing mode. I've been in all the everyone knows this from a from a planning perspective. You're like, I've got to get the pop up banners, I've got to get the napkins. Like. And so my printing mode this week has been around our workbook, which if you know, our tour, it's [00:13:00] very we've been jokingly calling it Warped Tour for accountants. And so the workbook actually looks like if you got a vinyl like record, it comes out of a sleeve and the workbook contains session materials for each of our sessions so that there's a hand on hands on piece of interactive exercise that you're doing with each speaker. And then in addition to that, we're giving away what we're calling our resource playlist. So that's all of the takeaway materials to take this theory and implement it fully inside your firm. And so it's packed with CPE. It's really like I'm a total teaching and [00:13:30] education nerd. So this is really about making advisory accessible and bringing events to people right where they are so that they can put it into action right away.
Nancy McClelland: I am so excited about this. I'm excited about all of them. I will be attending, uh, or speaking at all three of these and, um, I will I'll be at the Chicago Advisory Amplified, uh, which let me see, this episode's coming out on the 24th. So you will have just done LA. And that means that tomorrow you'll [00:14:00] be in Seattle, I believe backwards.
Madeline Reeves: So we'll have just done Seattle and then we'll be headed to LA next. Yep.
Nancy McClelland: All right. Fantastic. That's.
Questian Telka: And then she's got then she's got the other four. Right. And it is. How do they go.
Madeline Reeves: So we'll go. We'll and I I've got to give a shout out here because Aaron is actually our hometown host in Seattle. So she's hosting with me which again talk about collaboration. She has been amazing at supporting us and like getting word out to our Seattle network. So her and I will be like two of the hosts in Seattle. [00:14:30] And then we'll go to LA on September 25th, then up to Chicago. We'll see you, Nancy on September 30th. Austin, October 2nd. Atlanta. October 7th. And then. Boston is like our big blowout party on October 9th.
Questian Telka: Oh, and I'm going to be at all of these as well. I've been to wave. I'll be in, uh, Boston and Atlanta for advisory amplified. And we will Nancy and I will both be at Women Who Count. And actually, I'm going to take this moment to we've been teasing [00:15:00] on our LinkedIn for a minute about a big announcement that we have. We're not going to tell everybody the topic yet, but Nancy and I are going to be recording a live session on the main stage during a breakout at Women Who Count. It's going to be a two hour session. I think it's going to be really compelling. So, um, everybody come sign up for the session. Wait. Yeah, I can't wait either. It's.
Nancy McClelland: We met earlier today to plan it. Yeah.
Sharrin Fuller: Am I going to be able to know [00:15:30] what the topic is?
Nancy McClelland: Excited.
Questian Telka: I already told you what the topic was. Sharon. Oh, I just forgot.
Sharrin Fuller: I should, I should, I should maybe no, I should probably go in and take a look at that and see what that topic I'm. I wasn't even worried. I was 0% worried when I, when question was like, we should do this. I'm like, I've got a spot for you. Let's make it.
Questian Telka: Happen.
Sharrin Fuller: So then from there.
Questian Telka: Yeah. So we, you know, Nancy and I have these are all amazing conferences and we find value in all of them for [00:16:00] different reasons. And it's just an incredible community that's really exciting. And I know, um, Madeline, you already kind of hit on this a little bit, but I'm interested to hear, um, if you have some more ideas, Sharon, on some ways that it's you that Women who count is unique from some of the other conferences that are out there.
Sharrin Fuller: Um, yeah, absolutely. So it's really just women centric, right? It's really based on us. And you're hearing from other people. I'm I'm [00:16:30] a woman, obviously, I don't have children, but I really love when you can see other women who want all of it. They want their kids. They want their career. They want to be, you know, homemaker or I just love it that there's so many different types of women. They're all supporting each other and, um, how they get through it and how they do it. It's just really nice. And it's also it's also good because when you're a lot of women, um, for so long, maybe even in this day and age, have been taught to be quiet. And, [00:17:00] you know, this is what you do and accept it. So when you go to conferences like, like this and you see other people, like, you guys are just talking with Carla and you think, well, wait a second, they can do it, and you hear their story. It's so motivating. And I think some of the best things about going to these conferences are especially women who count is, um, when you go and you teach or you go and you just talk to people and somebody comes up to you later and says, I wasn't going to do it. But I'm so inspired and motivated now and then seeing them go and do it. I had a, um, session [00:17:30] last year. I taught about, um, becoming, um, from employee to entrepreneur and one of the one of the gals that sat in there.
Sharrin Fuller: She actually ended up quitting her job and started her own firm, which, um, she is now helping people that have accounting firms work on their burnout and balance. And honestly, that's like the most amazing piece of it, right? Like, just hearing that just one thing you said helped someone. And I just think there is there's a lot of that is it really is just kind of a little bit of a different vibe as most of the women conferences [00:18:00] are. But I know that this year we're really pushing for a, um, inclusivity meaning, um, like you go to some of the larger ones, there's a lot of sign up for this link to go to this event, this link to go to this event. And while that's amazing for all of us on this, because all of us get the pre invite and all of us are, you know, kind of a life of a party and we get to go to all of these things. But what about the quiet girl in the corner that deserves to be there too. She doesn't ever get to go. So I did let everybody know, like, anything we do [00:18:30] is for everybody. So we every event we have is for sponsors, exhibitors, everybody. There's no sign up sheet. It's you're at this conference, you're going and I made it really, really clear if that's just how it is. So we are really excited about that and that we're gonna everybody can just be involved with everything.
Nancy McClelland: And I would like to add that one of the things I think is special about the AfD Women Who Count conference, um, I really enjoyed it when I attended when it was in Chicago, is that I don't often get to meet [00:19:00] people who are in different size firms, and I really love the fact that it's not. I mean, there are women who are bookkeepers, there are women who are tax accountants, there are women who are auditors. There are also women in finance. There are also women who are working in-house in big firms or in-house in larger corporations, where they are the accounting function. And I really enjoyed the opportunity to meet women across a very large swath of the world of accounting and [00:19:30] finance, because we don't get to interact with each other as much as one might think. And so finding somebody who does recruiting or finding somebody who does banking, finding somebody who, um, is a lender or for whatever, you know, these are people that I'm going to end up calling later on and saying, hey, I need your help. For example, um, there's a an amazing, uh, tax attorney who, it turns out, lives a few blocks away. And she and I have been friends ever since that first Women Who Count conference that I attended. [00:20:00] Oh, yeah. So get to meet lots of different kinds of people at at women who count.
Questian Telka: And I wanted to ask if Erin or Madeline, do you guys either of you have any more things that are unique that you want to throw out there and are sure and want to mention? Madeline?
Madeline Reeves: Yeah, I'll go ahead and share. Yeah. One of the things that's really been a focus for our event is local flair and commitments to really giving back to the community. It's really a core part of our [00:20:30] values at Fearless Foundry, and so we've really worked to design an event that kind of takes this really cool power position that each of us are in as event organizers to really focus on partnering within our local community. And so that looks like a couple of things. One is we've partnered with our hometown hosts. So each city has a firm or several firms that we're highlighting in this community capacity. Because to me it's it's like it's like this story you're sharing right now, Nancy, about like meeting somebody and then going away and learning that you could work with them and building relationships [00:21:00] locally, I think is so important. Like, I've heard so many stories where people, you know, talked for like a year on Twitter, only to learn they lived like, you know, within like a few hours or like down the street from each other. And I'm like, I don't want that to happen. I want people to know right away we're local. We're going to hang out after this. And so our hometown hosts are people who are kind of pillars in the community that have raised their hand and said, hey, like, we're going to keep this energy rolling after the fact.
Madeline Reeves: And then in addition to that, every stop has really been a focus on celebrating local and small business. There's so many businesses that [00:21:30] are still working on recovering, not just from the pandemic, but just in general right now economically. And so for us, we've worked with our hometown hosts to be like, who's your favorite breakfast vendor? Like, who should we be hiring for this? And every single vendor that we're working with, from our venues all the way down to our catering, are all minority owned. And so we're really working on taking our resources and flowing them back into the local community. And then my other thing that I'm really excited to announce is that we've partnered with the AICPA, and there's a lot of disparity in this industry and especially [00:22:00] for women. And so we know that there's a lot of people who have an intention or a desire to get access to different levels of credentialing, but perhaps can't afford it from an economic perspective. And so we've partnered with the AICPA scholarship fund so that every stop on the tour is raising funds to donate to that, so that we can be giving back and creating opportunity for other people to step into the profession who might not have access. So we've built like a custom merch store. And, um, and it's designed to give back to that scholarship fund.
Nancy McClelland: I am so [00:22:30] excited to hear that. I don't know if this has come up, but I'm a judge for their scholarships. Oh my gosh.
Madeline Reeves: Yeah, we're all connected in some way.
Questian Telka: I love.
Nancy McClelland: It. Yes. Every year I evaluate, you know, many of the of the ones they they get multiple people like quite a few people to evaluate every single application so that it's not just one person making a decision and you know it. It tries to just create a lot of, um, equity across the reviewing process. And, [00:23:00] um, yeah, I've done that for a few years now. And it's a it's a very important part of my volunteer work. So I am absolutely thrilled to hear that you're doing that.
Madeline Reeves: The way that we're doing it is we have built a custom merch store so that even if people are not able to join us on the tour, they'll be able to shop all of the merch that's limited edition for this year's tour, and 100% of the proceeds for all of the merch goes back to the AICPA scholarship fund. So I'm really excited to see how much money we can raise as a community for it.
Questian Telka: And for our listeners. We will have a link [00:23:30] to that in our show notes, so you'll be able to access it directly. Sharon, did you want to add something?
Sharrin Fuller: I'm terrible because I did want to add that the A, the VA does also have a foundation. And our Thursday night is our foundation dinner, which we've just rebranded Counting the Stars brilliance beyond the balance sheet and everything from that. We have a scholarship as well with the Afwa, so we make sure it's separately ticketed. But thanks for reminding me, Madeleine. [00:24:00] I'm like, oh wait, I forgot. We have a whole foundation scholarship. They do things too. Okay, sorry.
Questian Telka: I love how much, um, how much thought is going into community in general through all of these events and conferences and, um, what happens next and what happens after. Right. Um, Aaron, do you have anything else to add about any unique things about wave before we keep going.
Erin Pohan: Yes, and I love that you said what happens before and what happens after, because that's a really unique [00:24:30] part of Wave Seattle is we do these zoom happy hours before and then after to kind of digest our takeaways from the event. So it's never just about the day of the event, and especially because I put this event out there thinking there's got to be people in the PNW who don't want to travel to Las Vegas or Orlando. And it turns out there are. But there are also women who want to come [00:25:00] to us. And so we ended up having this beautiful mix of women from across the country. And I was like, we need to expand this beyond just the event. We need to have these pre and post zoom meetings to meet and go deeper. We need to have events the night before, events the day after. And so it just really expanded. And it's a continuous community, um, beyond the event day itself.
Nancy McClelland: You know, you're you're putting me in mind. I wanted [00:25:30] to ask this question anyway, but since we've got you on the mic, can you share the origin story of wave and, um, specifically what gap you saw in the profession that inspired you to create this event?
Erin Pohan: I'm so glad that you mentioned the word gap, because I always talk about my conference Afterglows and wave. Seattle was really my afterglow from bridging the gap. And so it started back in 2022, technically was my first [00:26:00] accounting conference. It was QuickBooks connect, now Intuit Connect. And it was actually, um, Nancy, you said something earlier about, uh, Carla seeing Carla speak. Well, I saw Marriott Martinez speak on the stage, and I was like, okay, go, girl. But then she had this whole, like, front row of fans. And I was like, that is so cool. Like, I want that, I want community. And so that was the seed. And then fast forward to Bridging the Gap 2024, [00:26:30] which is the totally unique conference in itself. It's so special. It's so intimate compared to the larger conferences. And you really get to know people. You get to have real conversations with them. Um, between the sessions and after the, the day's events. And so I love Bridging the Gap. I had also attended another conference in LA that was just like a one day micro conference, and I was just really inspired to start something like that here in Seattle.
Nancy McClelland: That's amazing. As you know, Bridging [00:27:00] the Gap is my very favorite conference. And it is where, um, I met you a couple of conference seasons ago, and it's where you moderated this year, our, uh, Live She Counts podcast, which is actually going to be airing in, um, just about a month or so here. Month or two. Um, so that I'm so glad I had forgotten that bridging the gap was the catalyst for that. That is just wonderful. Madeline, what's your origin story? What gap [00:27:30] were you trying to fill?
Madeline Reeves: Yeah, so I probably have attended every single conference underneath the sun over the years, because in my other lifetime, you know, I was a global business development leader on the fintech and accounting side. And so it was my job to attend every single conference. And, you know, I've kind of shifted away from doing that on behalf of some of the partner like fintech companies. And now I attend as myself. And last year was the first time probably since about 2019, 2020, where I kind of like went to all [00:28:00] of the kind of standard big industry conferences again, and I just felt like there was a lot missing and there was a lot missing in the conversations. And what really struck me was there was this moment where I was like riding the escalator side by side with a woman, and she was like, I just feel like I'm drinking from a fire hose of inspiration and ideas, but I don't really know how to bring these back and put them into practice inside of my firm. And so I was hearing that, and then I was also hearing on the vendor side that there was more and more happening where a lot of the vendors were [00:28:30] being excluded from the topics or were being kind of pushed into the back of the room as a, as opposed to being able to contribute to conversations in a thought leadership capacity. And there's a lot of companies in this industry, probably too many for them, us to sponsor in a reasonable level. But there's a lot of them that have a lot of important insight to offer to some of the conversations, especially around advisory, because they're working with so many firms.
Madeline Reeves: And so basically, I started to get this idea in the back of my head of like, how can we do something that's more intimate, that's more hands on, [00:29:00] that's really giving people step by step guidance to walk away. Because if you're going to take a day out of your firm, you want to ensure that it was worth your time and also ensure that you're not coming back to like an onslaught of emails or an onslaught of people trying to hard sell you because you stop by their booth, but instead really getting those tangible takeaways. And so that was what kind of started the inspiration. And then I started like behind the scenes about a year ago, going to people and being like, what do you think about this? What do you think about this? I had seen wave come to life and I was like, oh [00:29:30] my gosh, like, somebody's doing this in Seattle. I got so hyped when I saw the success of that. Um, and it had been a while since we had done anything that was a tour. We hadn't done a tour since 2022, and so that tour idea was also something that was a new really worked. I had done that for many, many years back in my previous roles, and so once I pitched a couple people on it and they were like, yeah, we would do this, we we started planning in January and have been bringing it to life ever since.
Nancy McClelland: You know, I am so glad to hear both of you. Um, [00:30:00] and Aaron, actually, Sharon, you mentioned this as well, getting the vendors actually involved in these conversations as opposed to just showing us their wares, trying to sell us something in the expo hall. I see this as a trend. I know it was a big part of reframe, for example. Um, and, and I'm really excited to hear that. That's something that y'all are excited about and doubling down on, especially in the advisory Amplified tour where it's really about that. And Maddie, you know, when just now, when you're saying that, um, [00:30:30] you, uh, used to go to all of these conferences as part of your former life. You and I met at a Bookkeeping Buds retreat many, many, many years, probably a decade ago, if not longer. It must have been.
Madeline Reeves: You and Christian were telling that story. I was giggling on the inside because I was like, I'm pretty sure that's how Nancy and I met. And shout out to Cindy Schroeder like, there's so many people who have met through her community groups. And again, I just think it's really important to like hold up. There's there's events that I'm that I think we've all been inspired by, right. You [00:31:00] know, and so we're naming some of those names. But it's like, especially for me as an introvert, I feel like those settings were always settings where I felt like there was a different level of knowledge, share and trust and collaboration happening. That just doesn't happen at like a 1 to 5000 person event. And so that's one of the things I love about everything we're shaping, is that everyone on this call is doing an event that's designed to be more intimate.
Nancy McClelland: Absolutely. Now, Sharon, you have a different origin story. Oh I'm sorry. Go ahead. Question.
Questian Telka: I just wanted to, [00:31:30] um, comment on because I think it's a really important point. Nancy, you hit on it. Madeleine. It's part of the the framing around, um, around advisory amplify. Our vendors are incredible to us. And they have so much knowledge that I feel like, you know, sometimes people are looking at them like you're just a vendor. You're just trying to sell us stuff. You only hear we're coming through for swag. And so I think it's incredible that there's been more emphasis, focus on that knowledge, because there is so [00:32:00] much to be shared from them, not just from colleagues who own firms.
Nancy McClelland: Absolutely.
Madeline Reeves: This piece is really important to me, and I think I have a unique perspective because I've sat on both sides of the booth. And so I have been the vendor like I used to be in my previous life, for companies like Fathom and Avalara and Intuit. I've been kind of on the receiving end, like you guys of like using their tools and tech and solutions. And then I've also been in the interesting in between, which is now I consult with. And a lot of those companies are [00:32:30] clients of mine, and I really want to build the bridge between because you all have such great insights to offer them that they need to hear and listen to and learn from, and vice versa. And one of the things that was really powerful in my previous role was the fact that I would be working with thousands of firms at a time, and so my visibility into what was working and what wasn't from an advisory or a workflow or tools or technology or reporting perspective, was much more macro than sometimes people inside of an individual firm, [00:33:00] even if that was a super large firm. And so that's the part that I'm really excited about, is tapping the vendors who are then tapping firms and going, here's a perspective from a really big firm that's having success. Here's a perspective from a micro firm that's having success. And so most of our vendors are not speaking themselves. They've tapped somebody else in the industry to offer that perspective. Or they're partnering with them on the content they're creating, which I just think is really cool to see and isn't being seen at many events. And I also think, you know, again, I won't [00:33:30] name names, but there's more and more industry events that are banning some of the vendors or just relegating them, like we said, to the back of the room. And that just doesn't allow for that same level of collaboration and bridging to happen across, you know, from the vendor and the firm side of things.
Nancy McClelland: Now, Sharon, I know you have a different origin story because you didn't create the Women Who Count conference. You actually were inspired by attending one.
Sharrin Fuller: I was, I was I came in like a wrecking ball, that's for sure. But that's pretty in line with [00:34:00] anybody that knows me. Yeah. Honestly, I was I think I just started my very first accounting conference was, um, um, a weight scaling? No, no, it was engage in 2021 here in Vegas and then scaling in Fort Worth and then Accountingweb anyhow. So I, I decided I want to start speaking all these conferences. So I started googling like what where can I speak out? Because I didn't know any of you guys. I mean, I had accounting firms forever, but I didn't. I came into the scene around like 22 as well, anyhow, and I somehow [00:34:30] came across women who count. And I thought, what a powerful name of a conference. And so I applied to speak and I got chosen to speak. And then from there, I just, I don't know, there was just I've always been, um, the naughty girl group. Right. I, I was that girl that always had one girlfriend and like, eight guy friends. Always. Right. So you wouldn't catch me at a women's event in any way? Not that I get it. It's just not how I grew up. And I just always seem to get along better with the dudes. Um, and then when I [00:35:00] went to this conference, I was like, wow, I actually enjoy sitting here with all of these women, which is a new experience for me.
Sharrin Fuller: And it's actually it's been great for me. Um, as a person. I know I'm 45, but we we all grow and it's being involved with the afwa and women who count has got me out of I for so long. I worked with, um, software as a service and engineers and a lot of a lot of men. In that way, working with women is different [00:35:30] for the most part, and so it's really kind of softened me a bit, believe it or not. And it's just been a really good experience. And now I have this amazing community. I ended up on the board of the Afwa and the executive board, and now I'm the treasurer and now I'm chair of this thing. They kind of just they saw me and they were like, we're getting her for everything that we can. So but I'm really, really involved now. And but I love it. Like, these are my people. And they're not just people that are just like me, like some of them are 20, some of them are 75, and some of them own their own companies, and some [00:36:00] of them retired as a managing partner of a big four, you know. So we've got all walks of life here. And if it wasn't for women who count, I wouldn't have found any of it.
Questian Telka: I love that answer, and I think it segues really good into the next or really, well, really good. It segues really well into the next topic. So you were talking about how, um, you know, you were you kind of had one female good friend, and then it was a bunch of dudes that you hung around, and now you're so much more immersed in community of women. [00:36:30] And so something I want to throw out there is all three of you are conference leaders, firm owners, trailblazers in our industry. And yet here we all sit together. And so one could assume, and I think that there are sometimes things like this are said, one could easily assume that the relationships between everyone on this podcast would be of a competitive nature. But we all know that that's bullshit. And, um, but it begs the question, [00:37:00] How would you. Sharon. I'll go to you first. Address this misconception.
Sharrin Fuller: There is no competitiveness. Um, I was added to the ADP advisory board in 2017, and I think in 2018, Darren Root spoke to us. And this is probably one of the things of somebody speaking has ever stuck with me. He sat there. He said, all of you here own a firm, and all of you pretty much take the same type of clients, but almost never will any of you compete for the same client at the same [00:37:30] time. And I thought, that's amazing. It honestly changed my whole perspective of everything. So now when I go to these things, I'm learning. I want to learn. I care more about sitting and having the networking and hearing from people and hearing their their horror stories. I learn more from that than I do from from anything. And I don't know. I love the fact that I know so many people in this industry that if a client comes to me and it now doesn't fit in my box, I'm like, let me send you to the person who's box you fit into because you're [00:38:00] going to be a far better fit there than coming over here. And, you know, bull in a China shop breaking what we've got going on. So no, I there's I don't when you feel that competitiveness or somebody that has it coming from them, it's almost like you want to reach out to them and befriend them and teach them that this isn't the way. That's not what we do. We are all friends now. And so now, I think to me it's more of that, but I don't think I've ever gone to one of these conferences and thought, oh, competitor grossed.
Nancy McClelland: You know, there was one conversation [00:38:30] I had with you where I actually wrote the quote down, and I just had to run off just now to find it, um, because it it fits in with everything that you're saying here. You were talking about the work that you do with, um, venture capitalist groups that are, um, all men versus the work that you're doing with, um, AF. And your quote was with the men you need to scream to be heard. And with the women, if you scream, you won't be heard. And so I thought that really encapsulated it perfectly. [00:39:00]
Questian Telka: Such a good quote.
Sharrin Fuller: I forget that I said that, but it's true. It's so true. It's a different sitting in a you're the only woman at a round table with a bunch of men that are, you know, engineers versus sitting with a bunch of women. It is two different groups of people. And I had to relearn that, and I didn't. I wasn't very successful at the beginning, but I think I'm a little better now.
Nancy McClelland: Well, as you know, we believe women led conferences. They can really change the conversation around leadership advancement and inclusion in accounting. [00:39:30] And I want to know, um, Madeline, why do you think that women in accounting need a separate platform right now? Like what? What need? Is that fulfilling? Why are conferences, um, not just for but by women? Because your conference advisory amplified is not women only, but it was created entirely by women. Why are they important? Why are they why? What role are they playing?
Madeline Reeves: So for me, I think there is just a unique [00:40:00] set of challenges that women leaders face in accounting and also in every industry that are not necessarily being spoken about or addressed, or if they are at some of the larger camp sessions or conferences, I see them as like it's those breakout things, you know, on the side rooms as opposed to something that's that's on the main stage. And so I'll give an example. Pricing. There is such an important conversation to be had about pricing, and I bet every single one of us has been to a large conference [00:40:30] and been to a session on pricing and just been told, you just have to follow this formula or you just have to do x, y, z. And yet nobody is backing up attached to talk about our scarcity mentality, about systemic barriers that impact the way that we think about money, to talk about the ways that the wage gap has fundamentally shaped, so that women think that we should be charging less, and especially if we're doing comparative analysis of pricing just across women led firms. Chances are our numbers might be a lot lower than men led [00:41:00] firms.
Madeline Reeves: And so to me, I think there's a perspective that that needs to be leading from the direction of the experiences of women at these events so that the conversation is more inclusive. Because the thing that happens in this industry is that even though the industry is majority female, still we have an issue at the top where there's more men in those leadership roles. And so the conversations are being catered to their experiences, and they're speaking from what they know as opposed to what we need to see, which is a conversation that's inclusive [00:41:30] to all and perhaps even directs a little bit more to the experiences of women, because we're having more barriers and challenges that aren't being talked about. The other thing, too, that I think about is like when I think about, you know, the women in this room or the women I know in the industry, we're not just juggling our roles as leaders, but we also have a lot more responsibility in our personal lives, on top of of being firm runners. Runner. So I'm like, I know what question I DM about, you know, I know that.
Questian Telka: Like all.
Madeline Reeves: I'm thinking about like Twila and I and like all these women who [00:42:00] are like, on top of that, we're caregiving, managing households, supporting our communities, giving back, volunteering, sitting on boards, you know, and so many of our male peers, by comparison, are not, you know, having those same levels of responsibility. Or they might even have somebody at home taking on those roles. So really, their primary focus is just, you know, succeeding inside their career. And for us as women, there's much more of a balance or a juggling act. And so I really think that it's important for us to have spaces where we can be honest [00:42:30] about that and share the strategies that are really working for us, because to me, it wasn't until I got into spaces where women were leading the conversations or owning those conversations, that I felt like I could talk openly about what I was navigating as a founder and CEO. That was also a woman. And so for me, like like you said, Nancy, our event is not exclusively for women, but it's leaning in the direction of women leaders so that we can have a conversation that's inclusive to the experiences of all, as opposed to leaving those things on the sideline.
Questian Telka: Yeah, [00:43:00] I think, um, you make some very interesting and amazing points. Having content that is directed and created by women is so important. One session that really stuck out in my mind recently was when I was at wave at Aaron's conference, and Twyla was speaking about AI, and she was talking about how important it was that we are as women, playing [00:43:30] with it, using AI and experimenting because it's directly learning from the information and the inputs that we are putting in. And if we're not using those tools, then we're looking at ChatGPT and the progression of AI being developed without our perspectives in mind. So I think that's, um, you know, it's so important to have those sessions, and I can't see that being in a mainstage session at, you know, at a larger conference that is more focused on, on men. [00:44:00] And, um, Twila is actually going to be a guest on advisory amplified as well. Right? She's speaking. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's amazing. And I actually recently took a course with she and Byron from TV Academy, and it was an AI foundations course, and it was so well done and well thought out and perfectly layered. And I believe they're actually going to also be offering a course that's more directed for [00:44:30] women as well. So, um, and.
Nancy McClelland: How did we find out about that course question? It was because we were recording with Twila on this podcast because she is an upcoming guest. Yes.
Questian Telka: Yeah. And all of that.
Nancy McClelland: Got a whole episode that's about this topic.
Questian Telka: All of that from the collaboration and the conversations. And, you know, me flying from North Carolina clear to Seattle to attend wave and like just being completely inspired from that moment. So yeah, having those topics and [00:45:00] sessions directed for things that are important to us is so essential. So as I was saying, it's really important in shaping, shaping us. It's also important in shaping the generation of women leaders in accounting. And I'm curious, what's a topic women in accounting are hungry to discuss, but that often gets ignored at mainstream conferences. Madeline, do you want to jump in [00:45:30] or I'll give one.
Madeline Reeves: And then I'm curious to hear from others too. So one that I am really getting transparent about at Advisory Amplified probably more than I really expected to, but I started talking about it on my podcast about a year ago, and so I'm bringing it to the main stage is an honest conversation about the reality of being a woman leader and a primary breadwinner in marriage and partnership. So, as many of you know, I publicly shared about my divorce trajectory over the last couple of years, and I'll be talking about [00:46:00] how I had to make the decision to choose my company over my marriage because I know many, many female CEOs and most of us are not married anymore or on second marriages. And if we are married, we've had to do a lot of work to ensure that we have a partnership that isn't just operating off of traditional gender roles and a partner that really supports us in our work. And so I find that many women struggle with any sort of traditional expectations that can clash with our ambitions. And so [00:46:30] for me, I plan to just open up a space where we can have some real conversations about what it looks like to have healthy relationships that support our careers rather than limit them. So that is one that I needed other women to start talking about. So I started talking about it. And then I found I was having a lot of sidebars. And so I'm going to share openly about my challenges and struggles there in hopes that it creates space for more conversation.
Questian Telka: Erin, have there been I mean, you obviously put together some amazing topics. Have you since [00:47:00] wave? Um, have you had any other topics come out that or heard of any that women are hungry to talk about and hear about?
Erin Pohan: Yes. And first of all, I'm going to be front row in that session because I retired my husband earlier this year. And so our roles have completely reversed. And I'm still getting used to it, but I'm so excited and hungry for that. So, um, I think Nancy may have coined this term, um, messy middle. And [00:47:30] I think this is the conversation that a lot of people just want to dive into. And so I know I do selfishly, but since wave, I feel like this is where a lot of women feel stuck. Um, they may have started a firm. They don't necessarily know where they want to go in the firm. And if they even know where they want to go, they don't know how to get there. And so this concept of the messy middle, how to navigate where you're trying to go [00:48:00] despite life's circumstances or, um, not knowing how to get there.
Questian Telka: That's amazing. Sharon.
Sharrin Fuller: I was honestly trying to remember what I put, but now my brain went elsewhere. So in the pre thing, I just want to say that the that I also agree with Madeline. So I retired my husband in like 2012. And let me tell you what, that was a lot of therapy. Um and it's still to this day really hard because it's [00:48:30] just hard. And the more I do, you know, the more it's like one of those things. Like, I just keep telling them, it's not that you're not doing anything, it's that you're supporting me more. And it's just a continual struggle for forever. Not because of us, but because of the world. Right. So definitely topping that off there. But. Um, and a lot it's becoming a very common thing. Um, so I, I completely agree to that. I'm very, very fortunate in the support I have. But I also think there's a, a conversation that we all need to have is how how do you how [00:49:00] do you get that seat at the table amongst all the men? Women were the go getters. We're the gsd's that get stuff done, people. We're the, um. If no one else is doing it, just move. I'll get it done. Right. And most of the time men know that and they rely on that. Um, and because of that, they sit at the, at the table and they, they dole out all the work to us. Well, how do we get to that table and how do we do it without being called emotional? Because if we're too angry or too harsh about our tone, we're [00:49:30] emotional. If something makes me mad and I get a little weepy because I really only cry when I'm emotionally devastated, or I'm so angry that my my tears are just burning. Um, but then again, that makes us emotional. And if we're emotional, we can't leave, right? And it's just such a it's a conversation we need to have and, and topics that we need to discuss. How do we get there while being ourselves without everybody saying, oh, they're just emotional. They're not going to be able to make those decisions?
Nancy McClelland: Absolutely. I am [00:50:00] so glad that is, you know, when question and I dreamed up the idea of this podcast. Um, it was we really wanted it to be about real talk. And we even say in every intro we're saying the things out loud that other people aren't. And I think that what you just brought up there is definitely one of those. Erin, I have one in particular that I would like for you to share with our audience. Um, one moment from your conference that captures the heart and impact [00:50:30] of the Wave conference that has really stuck with you.
Erin Pohan: I think there was this moment we had this group peer strategy session where we had firm owners share two different pain points. One was more technical related, the other one was around loneliness. And we had one firm owner just get very vulnerable about how lonely it can be to run a firm. And I remember I had to take the stage right after that, and I just had this [00:51:00] moment where like and I feel it now. I just like had these tears just well up because I'm like, me too. You're you're not alone. And I think every woman in that room felt that moment together. And it was just really beautiful because it's just a reminder that we're doing it alone sometimes, but we don't have to. And, um, if there's anything that came from wave, I just hope someone found their person to pick up the phone and call, even if they don't have the [00:51:30] right words, even if it's an ugly cry. Um, just to just do it together.
Nancy McClelland: Well, thank you so much for that. This has been an incredible conversation. Thank you all so much for being here. As we wrap up, we'd like to ask listeners to follow our She Accounts Podcast LinkedIn page and to join in on this conversation by sharing under the episode Why Women's Conferences Hit Different. By sharing under [00:52:00] the episode amplifying women who Count the Wave of women's conferences shaping accounting. I love question that you came up with a title that actually combines every single title of each of these conferences. It's perfect. Um, so under that post, could you please share with us what would you like to see as an attendee at a conference? That's for and by women? We want to hear your thoughts.
Questian Telka: We want to hear your [00:52:30] thoughts. And we have conference organizers here who are listening and paying attention. So please make sure you comment because they're just as interested as we are. And before we sign off, I want to leave everyone with a quote by Serena Williams. The success of every woman should be in the inspiration to another. We should raise each other up. Make sure you're very courageous. Be strong. Be extremely kind. And above all, be humble.
Nancy McClelland: That's a beautiful quote. [00:53:00] Thank you for sharing that with us. And thanks to all of our guests and to our audience for being here with us on She Counts, the Real Talk podcast for women in accounting.
Questian Telka: If something in today's episode hit home for you, well, that's exactly why we're doing this.
Nancy McClelland: So you feel seen. Heard. And as Aaron and Sharon and Madeleine have mentioned numerous times in this episode, Never Alone.
Questian Telka: Remember that you can [00:53:30] get CPE credit for listening at earmarked links to that, as well as how to learn more about our sponsors, solutions and any other resource will be in the show notes.
Nancy McClelland: And please subscribe and leave us a review because it helps other people find the podcast. Also, please share with another woman in accounting who needs to hear it too.
Questian Telka: Many thanks again to our incredible powerhouse guests Maddie Reeves, Aaron Cohen, and Sharon [00:54:00] Fuller. We are so grateful to the three of you for, um, joining us today. We kind of made it happen really fast, and it's just I love that. Um, you guys were all able to be here together because it just made it. Um, it just showed the level of community that we all have so much more deeply.
Nancy McClelland: Thank you for being here. And we'll see everyone in two weeks.