There may be errors in spelling, grammar, and accuracy in this machine-generated transcript.
Nancy McClelland: Welcome to She Counts the Real Talk podcast for Women in Accounting, where your hosts, Nancy McClelland.
Questian Telka: And Questian Telka.
Nancy McClelland: And every episode we're digging into the real experiences, challenges, and unspoken truths of life in this profession.
Questian Telka: Because if you've ever felt like you're the only one, you're not, and you shouldn't have to figure [00:00:30] it out alone.
Nancy McClelland: Special thanks to our season two sponsors Forwardly Relay and Clienthub. We are so grateful to them for helping us bring these conversations to life, enabling us to share out loud what everyone's thinking but no one's saying. Learn more about them on our sponsors page at accounts.com.
Questian Telka: And also remember that you can go to earmarked to earn CPE credit for listening to the episodes.
Nancy McClelland: And please follow the She Counts podcast [00:01:00] on LinkedIn to join the conversation.
Questian Telka: Today's episode is called You Know You're a Woman in Accounting when. And we're getting close to the end of our second season. And many of us are deep into taxes. So Nancy and I thought it would be a little bit of fun to do something different with this episode.
Nancy McClelland: And it's a really special day today because when this episode airs, it will be [00:01:30] on questions birthday. It's birthday. It's birthday. It's birthday. So today we are planning a hopefully hilarious, unfiltered, definitely unfiltered celebration of not only her birthday, but of some shared moments and absurdities and inside jokes that prove, you know you're a woman in accounting when your career, life, and sense of humor are permanently intertwined. [00:02:00]
Questian Telka: That's right. So this episode is about laughing, having fun, making, making light of some of the topics that we've already discussed throughout the first couple of seasons and some topics that we haven't yet talked about. And as is typical, we love watching each episode with a story. And Nancy, can you share with everyone why we were feeling that a light hearted episode was in order?
Nancy McClelland: Yes, [00:02:30] because as I mentioned, by the time this airs will be deep into tax season. Everyone is tired. Us politics are really heavy right now. And more importantly, we've covered some pretty weighty topics on the show imposter ism, glass ceilings, plagiarism, pricing disparities, personal crisis, burnout, sexual harassment. Right? Like this [00:03:00] is just to name a few. Yeah. Intense. As promised, when we started this podcast, we don't shy away from real talk. So we're, we've been digging into some, some pretty real topics. So we felt an episode on the lighter side was in order. And the best way to do that was crowdsourcing from our incredible community. Thank you so much to the many women who shared their stories with us.
Questian Telka: Yeah, we did get a lot of shared stories, and [00:03:30] we want to give a special shout out to Eileen Gilpin and Kendy Bello, who over and over again have been so supportive of She Counts and the podcast. Nancy and I, they reach out to us on a regular basis about episodes that resonate specifically with them and why, and we just really appreciate both of you and we really appreciate all of our, our listeners and everyone who sends us feedback and [00:04:00] lets us know that, um, you know, it's making a difference for them.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah, yeah. It means so much to us every time that we get a text or a WhatsApp or an email or a LinkedIn comment, it just, it makes our day, it makes our week, it makes our like year. It makes everything about why we're doing this. It just makes it all feel so dang worth it.
Questian Telka: Well, and we also can't help but like, share it with each other, right?
Nancy McClelland: Oh, yeah. You know, so.
Questian Telka: It's like, oh, hey, [00:04:30] did you see this comment? Did you see this?
Nancy McClelland: Definitely.
Questian Telka: And, um, you know, and especially makes it really great when you're having like one of those, one of those days or moments and you're going, you know, it always seems like those comments and messages.
Nancy McClelland: Come at the.
Questian Telka: Right time at the perfect time. Exactly.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah, yeah. You say that to me a lot, actually. I'll send you a screenshot of something and be like, oh, this is exactly what I needed to hear it. So maybe you always need to hear it. I don't know, but it does seem to always come at the at the right time. [00:05:00] And today is the perfect time because happy freaking birthday, happy birthday, happy birthday, happy birthday. I am so excited to be able to celebrate with you even though we're not in person together. Yeah. Um, so what, what year is this? 4444, 44.
Questian Telka: That's right. I know, and I used to get sad as I was getting older, and now I just look at it as like, well, I'm privileged to actually [00:05:30] continue getting older.
Nancy McClelland: So yeah.
Questian Telka: And I like birthdays.
Nancy McClelland: Father in law sometimes says he said, um, you know, don't be upset about getting older because it's a privilege denied to many. So yeah, that's a, that's a really nice way to look at it.
Questian Telka: That's a perfect way. Perfectly said.
Nancy McClelland: Well, you look pretty freaking fantastic for 44.
Questian Telka: Thank you, thank you, I appreciate that. You know, I try, but I think it's mostly, you know, my, uh, [00:06:00] I, my, my genetics. My mom is, um, I have to do the math now 64 and she looks incredible. You would never guess that she is amazing. 64 years old.
Nancy McClelland: So I'm confused though, because I think you had told me at some point that you you expired at 37.
Questian Telka: Yeah. That's right, I did. So, um, the first, you know, you're a woman in accounting or it could be business or it could just be a woman in general, right? When you're, when your age [00:06:30] is apparently past your prime, but your experience, revenue and boundaries are like thriving finally for the first time.
Nancy McClelland: In your life.
Questian Telka: Um, but yeah.
Nancy McClelland: I feel like your career and your confidence missed the memo that your, your past, your prime at this point, right?
Questian Telka: It sure did. Absolutely. And it's funny that you say that because the story comes from when I was 37. A male colleague said to me at one point, and, you know, like partially [00:07:00] being serious, maybe partially joking. I think mostly he meant it in a serious way. You know, he said, how does it feel to be a woman and be past your prime? I said.
Nancy McClelland: He actually said those words to you.
Questian Telka: Yeah, I actually said those words to me.
Nancy McClelland: What the actual f how does it feel to be a big jerk? That's just amazing. I don't know, what does it feel like to be an asshole that well. [00:07:30]
Questian Telka: And my response to him was, I just looked him dead in the eye and I said, past my prime, I haven't even gotten close to hitting my prime yet. I don't know what you're talking about. You know I'm spicy.
Nancy McClelland: Oh my God, that is absolutely amazing. Wow. And I'm guessing that that's one that's not just, you know, you're a woman in accounting when that's probably in a lot in life. Yeah, yeah.
Questian Telka: You know, you're a woman.
Nancy McClelland: I know, but.
Questian Telka: Because it was my birthday, I was like, we have to. I have to share this story. Um, [00:08:00] and so, you know, I, I know in accounting, a lot of assets depreciate with age, but I prefer to think of myself as an asset whose value compounds over time. So.
Nancy McClelland: Nice one, I love it. All right. Well happy birthday. I'm glad you're here. I'm glad you decided to spend it with us. Um. All right, our next. You know, you're a woman in accounting. When conferences. [00:08:30] Right? When conference packing requires strategy, stamina, and at least one backup tote.
Questian Telka: Yeah, I love this one. I could talk about this one, this topic forever because, you know, you and I both.
Nancy McClelland: Love so different on this one. You and I are so different on this one. All right, first tell us tell us your your packing strategy. And then I'm going to talk about the first time that I visited your hotel room. Oh [00:09:00] no.
Questian Telka: That's kind of I know where that's going. Yeah. Um, so well, my packing strategy is that I don't, I pack is whatever I need, and I take as many bags as I need because I don't like to be somewhere and have to buy something that I don't have or have to live without something that I don't want. So I've gotten a lot better about paring it down to a carry on, but I typically check my bag. But what [00:09:30] I will say that's funny is I know for I'm pretty sure that you and I don't qualify under this category because both of us are kind of, um, minimalists, I would say. Um.
Nancy McClelland: I love that you think of yourself as a minimalist? I can't wait to tell the story about the first time I visited your hotel room. Actually, not when it comes up. You right now. It was. It was clothes or shoes.
Questian Telka: Not when it comes to clothes or shoes.
Nancy McClelland: Okay. All right.
Questian Telka: Or makeup? [00:10:00]
Nancy McClelland: All right, so you're a minimalist. Except not with clothes, not with shoes, not with makeup, and not with collecting swag.
Questian Telka: No, I am with collecting swag. But I.
Nancy McClelland: Think.
Questian Telka: It's funny because there are so many people who, when they go to conferences, they're like, I have to bring an extra empty suitcase to collect the swag. And it's like, I have no room in my suitcase for the swag because it's filled with clothes and shoes, right?
Nancy McClelland: Because you're only a minimalist on. Okay, so that means you're minimalist on [00:10:30] on acquiring the new stuff at the conference, but you're not a minimalist in terms of what you bring with you.
Questian Telka: Yes.
Nancy McClelland: That's right. All right. Well, that makes more sense, you know? That reminds me of, um, of, um, Lynda Artesani, I remember said at one point in one of the conference chats that she actually. So her bestie is Matt Fulton and, um, which a lot of us call spot. That's his nickname, Spartacus. [00:11:00]
Questian Telka: Oh I didn't. Oh, that's right, I did know that. I knew I didn't know the short version. Spot.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah. Spot. So. So she makes spot carry around her second bag that she brings that is just full of shoes because she brings so many shoes to a conference.
Questian Telka: I can relate to that. I can relate to that. I, um, well, you mean you've been in my hotel room, but I remember, like, when, um, I had, like, a colleague come into my hotel room other than [00:11:30] you at one point and like, we were getting something ready for the conference and he looked at the floor and was like, why do you have so many shoes? And we were in. To be fair, We were in Vegas for the conference, so it's like you need conference shoes and dinner shoes and dancing shoes. At least that was. That's what I needed.
Nancy McClelland: So yeah.
Questian Telka: That is so funny. She had him carry her extra.
Nancy McClelland: She had her extra suitcase. It was just it was just [00:12:00] shoes. Yeah, totally. And he was like, yep, that was me. That's my job. That's that's that's why they call me the conference husband. He just carries around her extra bag. Yeah. The first time I went to in your room, it was at the Bookkeeping Buds retreat years ago, um, which I think was the first time we met each other. Right. It was your first conference ever.
Questian Telka: Yeah, yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Wow. That is so cool. Well, then. Yeah, it had to have been the first time that we met. At the time, you were a contractor [00:12:30] with me and you had just started your own business. And we met through bookkeeping buds and we went to the retreat and we decided because there was a I will say the one thing where I am not a minimalist when I'm packing for conferences is I bring costumes with me. Oh my gosh, a reason to bring a costume. And we were dressing up for that conference. There was a dinner and there was like a costume theme for the dinner, I guess. And I had brought [00:13:00] costumes because I always bring costumes. And you were like, oh no, what am I going to do? And I think maybe was Don Slocan. She also was a contractor for me at the time and had started her own business. And we were like, let's go together as the Glitter Sisters, right?
Questian Telka: Wasn't that something like that? Like we were.
Nancy McClelland: The Secret Sisters?
Questian Telka: Yeah, something like that. And you know, when I came to your house and you are not a minimalist in costumes and you pulled out this plethora of [00:13:30] costumes just like, oh, it was just like, here's all these things to choose from. Yeah. And it was.
Nancy McClelland: It was great. And so we picked all of these sequined things out, and I brought them all with me to the conference. Um, because I live in Chicago and the conference was in Naperville, so I could, I could drive from home and we all just completely did ourselves up in sequins from head to toe. It was, it was great. And then it was great because Cindy Schroeder, who runs bookkeeping, but she gave us all tiaras. So we had these like light up tiaras on top of the the sequined [00:14:00] outfits. It was it was pretty fantastic. But I went into your room and there was just there was stuff everywhere. I was like, there's no, there's literally no physical space in this room that it does not have a thing of yours on it. It was just amazing. And I was like, wait, you bring a hairdryer with you? Wait, you bring a I can't even remember what else. There was so much stuff in the bathroom. I was like, I think I need to up my game because you just had it all. And you know, my my [00:14:30] business bestie Melissa Miller Ferguson, she she brings. Not only does she bring a hairdryer, but she brings a diffuser like a full size diffuser. Oh yeah. Conferences. That's why her hair always looks better than mine.
Questian Telka: I bring a clothing steamer, I bring. Like I said, I don't like to be without the things that I need at any at any given moment. So I just throw it all in. And inevitably somebody at the conference is like, I need a X, y, Z. And I'm like, I have it. What do you need? Do you have safety pins? I have safety pins.
Nancy McClelland: I [00:15:00] have safety pins. I have, I come prepared. I am, I am obsessed with it takes me a very long time to pack because I'm obsessed with having absolutely everything I need and not one thing more. I never, you know, I have these really severe back issues. So like I am not carrying more than a carry on. I am not carrying more than a carry on. And so, you know, I've got, I've got to be really, really judicious about what I'm bringing with me. So I make a list, um, [00:15:30] you know, just a handwritten list of each day of the conference. And then what I have going on each of those days. If I have a presentation or an event or something. You know, if there's a dance thing, if there's a dinner, um, if I'm doing a vendor event or something like that, I write all of those out in the next column, and then I start filling in what clothing I'm going to bring so that I can reuse stuff so that I, and then I have my final column is shoes so that I can reuse those. So that way I'm not bringing [00:16:00] too much and everything's getting used at least once. That is really important to me. Except costumes is one of the things that's going to be on that list, and it wouldn't be on most people's lists. But man, I have a picture of me with Leslie Odom Jr on Halloween when I'm wearing a pinata costume, and he did not say a word about it. He just smiled at me. And we.
Questian Telka: Just looked.
Nancy McClelland: At you.
Questian Telka: And I've seen I know that costume that you're talking about too. It's a.
Nancy McClelland: Good one. Aerobics costume that for, [00:16:30] um, like that I did for women who count for um, when I led the whole room in. Um. She works hard for the money. I've got a watermelon costume, which was really fun because there was one year where we were all dressing up as different kinds of candy. And, um, so Candy Bello and I both were watermelon costumes, and we were watermelon candy. Isn't that cute?
Questian Telka: That's so cute.
Nancy McClelland: I know, so costumes is the one exception.
Questian Telka: So [00:17:00] I think at conferences, one of the things that happens to a lot of us is you've made a lifelong friend in the line for a bathroom or somewhere else along the way. It's like in the most random of places. And you start up these conversations and then, you know, it becomes like your business bestie, which you met through bookkeeping buds. But yeah, I actually met my partner in the Starbucks line.
Nancy McClelland: Which is your [00:17:30] partner like, like not life partner. Like not business partner.
Questian Telka: Like romantic partner. Yeah. And the line at Starbucks.
Nancy McClelland: Starbucks line at a conference, at an accounting.
Questian Telka: At a conference.
Nancy McClelland: Oh.
Questian Telka: Yeah. Isn't that funny?
Nancy McClelland: Well, here's another.
Questian Telka: It's like the most random of places.
Nancy McClelland: You know, you're a woman in accounting. If, uh, you have a makeup artist, visit your room at 7 a.m.. Vanessa Vasquez actually does this. She will get a group of people together. Well, she'll be like, I'm hiring a makeup [00:18:00] artist. Who else wants makeup artist to come visit their room? And five, six, seven in the morning. This makeup artist will go from room to room. I mean, have you seen how incredible Vanessa's.
Questian Telka: Oh, yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Makeup is.
Questian Telka: It's usually. To be fair, we don't want to scare anyone that wants to come to a conference and make them think you have to get a makeup artist. To be fair, it's usually the speakers, right? The speakers and presenters. I don't either, I do my own. I can't even be.
Nancy McClelland: Bothered to bring a diffuser like [00:18:30] Melissa, or to bring a. What did you say? It was a a steamer for your clothing.
Questian Telka: Oh, yeah. Clothing steamer. No no no no no no no. What's it even called? No, I.
Nancy McClelland: Always look, I always look a little ragged at the conferences, but hey, that's what I look like in real life. So you know.
Questian Telka: That's not true.
Nancy McClelland: I can't be bothered with that. Just come as you are. Come as you.
Questian Telka: Are. But if you're coming, make sure that you bring a survival [00:19:00] kit.
Nancy McClelland: Oh, yeah. Actually, that's a that's a great idea.
Questian Telka: This is like, that's one of the most important things, right? Like I am always freezing, right? Always cold. Yeah. So I have to bring a pashmina, um, or a scarf or a parka.
Nancy McClelland: You know what you need to have? You need to have my best friend because she is a fiber artist and she makes me the most beautiful ponchos. And I just pick one to bring with me to every single conference because oh my God, [00:19:30] I just I am always, always, always freezing. Why are the conference rooms always so freaking freezing?
Questian Telka: I don't know, they're always cold. They're either super hot or super cold. Sometimes you need a fan. I know when one of the episodes that we recorded at Scaling New Heights, neo had her battery powered fan with her.
Nancy McClelland: That's right. Oh my.
Questian Telka: Gosh. Good swag.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah. That that would actually that would be really good. She counts swag. A little battery powered [00:20:00] fan, which you know Mindy Lubki her you know you're a woman in accounting if was you have both a pashmina scarf and a battery operated fan in the bag that you're bringing to every session.
Questian Telka: Yeah, it's true. It's pretty much the case. I hope we're not turning anyone off from, uh, attending conferences. They really are a lot of fun.
Nancy McClelland: They are. They are so much fun. And I think the best thing about conferences and, and one of my favorite. You know, you're a woman in accounting. If submissions [00:20:30] that we got was from Ellen Oliver, who just nailed it when she said, finally getting to meet your internet friends in real life.
Questian Telka: Yeah, that's that's key. It's really, it's really amazing.
Nancy McClelland: Please come to the conferences and all of those people that you've met on sheet counts. Uh, LinkedIn page or Instagram account in the comments. Make plans to get together and meet up at the next conference. We'll be there.
Questian Telka: Um, [00:21:00] yes. Yeah, we are pretty much a lot of them. So another one that I think is, um, oh my gosh, this one is just so funny to me and is, uh, very personal to my life is, you know, you're a woman in accounting when you've tried to schedule your life events around your busy season and then laughed when the universe ignored you. So I, I tried to schedule. Well, I didn't try to [00:21:30] schedule it. I tried, I thought I was going to have my son. He was due on Christmas. My oldest, who is now 15, was actually due on Christmas Day. And I was like, yes, I get the tax, you know, benefit. And um.
Nancy McClelland: He wanted it was a write off during that year.
Questian Telka: Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Of course.
Questian Telka: Like who wouldn't?
Nancy McClelland: Oh my God.
Questian Telka: But that's what.Went through my head. I was like, oh great. He's going to be born on you know, I wasn't excited about him being born on Christmas necessarily, but I was like, oh, it'll be around then. But he decided [00:22:00] he was a little too cozy. And so he was born, um, in January, two weeks later instead. And so like I was, I actually was really upset worst.
Nancy McClelland: Oh my God, I know because I mean, you're an EA, but you don't do taxes. So for you, your busiest month is actually January because you're doing 1099 and year end closing Encloses a grant reporting. Oh, my God, you messed up. Girl, you [00:22:30] messed up. You should've told me, Jackie Meyer, because Jackie's. You know you're a woman in accounting. If was that she planned for both of her children to be born before the busy season. And she also said. Yeah, yeah, it absolutely worked with her. So, you know, she's people asked her, um, if she was doing it to get the, the deduction, just like you were saying. And she was like, no, I'm actually doing it so that I am not um, so that I can be in the office [00:23:00] during busy season, you know? Robina Bennion did the same exact thing and it worked for her too. Um, and she, well, sometimes.
Questian Telka: You can't plan it because, you know, like nature is just.
Nancy McClelland: Because nature.
Questian Telka: Cooperate.
Nancy McClelland: Well, Jackie and Robina both got it to work out, except that Rubina's story was that her grandma. When Rubina was like trying to to plan when her babies were going to come. Her [00:23:30] grandma was like, you can't plan your whole life. And Rubina says, oh yeah, grandma, watch me.
Questian Telka: That's pretty funny. Yeah, it's like, I didn't I didn't get the, um, the, I didn't get the tax savings, the tax benefit, but I did get a garnet, which was my favorite birthstone and oh, our favorite gemstone. And so I have this beautiful ring that is, um, symbolic of his month of birth. And that was like my, that's what made [00:24:00] me feel better about it because I have to say, it was really annoyed.
Nancy McClelland: Well, not having kids, I don't have to worry about any of this stuff. I gotta say this, this part of the of the episode is just hilarious to me because, um, you know, I get to laugh at other people's struggles, you know, like a really empathetic person that I am. And speaking of struggles, you know our friend Jean Zic. You heard about her story?
Questian Telka: Yeah. Um, walking to work while she was nine months [00:24:30] pregnant in a blizzard. Not just walking to work in a blizzard.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah, in a blizzard.
Questian Telka: I'm not sure if I. I'm not sure if I would have done that. Well, thankfully, she. Please tell me I don't know the whole story. Please tell me she didn't go into labor while she was on this walk.
Nancy McClelland: She did not. She did not. She she did just fine. Um, she was in a situation this was back in the late 90s and, um, wires had to be faxed and so she something, [00:25:00] you know, a client really needed something. And so she, they told her she had to go into work. There was this blizzard going on and, and she did it. And I was just like, oh my gosh, that like, I thank goodness for today's remote workforce and the technology that allows us to do that because that just sounds awful.
Questian Telka: Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, mad credit to her for being that kind of person, but.
Questian Telka: Not that one kind [00:25:30] of leads into the, you know, you're a woman in accounting. If you've cried over something that had nothing to do with accounting. But it was definitely about accounting. And like I, I say like every year, you know, you're a woman in accounting if every January or I mean, this is me for me every January, I say, I want to quit accounting. And I was like, I joke about this because this is how I feel every January. I eventually get over [00:26:00] it, but every year I'm like, I need to change careers.
Nancy McClelland: That's hilarious.
Questian Telka: People can relate to that.
Nancy McClelland: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And I mean, I, I have pride over something that had nothing to do in accounting with accounting. That was definitely accounting. Myself, and it probably happened in January because, I mean, I think we can we can agree that, uh, January is the worst. I mean, it's, there's a meme [00:26:30] that I recently shared on, um, LinkedIn that was, uh, it's that mnemonic, you know, 30, 30 days have September, April, June and November, all the rest of 31 except for February with 28. You know, that one? Yeah. There's a guy who rewrote it and it's something like, you know, 30 days have September, April, June, blah, blah, blah. All the rest have something, something except for January with 426,913. [00:27:00]
Questian Telka: I've seen. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's how it feels.
Nancy McClelland: And speaking of crying and emotions, let's talk about hormones. You know you're a woman in accounting if.
Questian Telka: You carry temperature control tools, which we talked about because offices and conference rooms are unhinged.
Nancy McClelland: Unhinged.
Questian Telka: Not temperature controlled, apparently or not temperature controlled for, [00:27:30] I don't know, I guess.
Nancy McClelland: Women hormones. The change of life. Yeah. I mean, yeah, well, I don't know how you would temperature control for that because one person over here is going to be freezing, and one person over here is going to be having a hot flash, and then one person over there. I don't think there is any normal. It's all over the place, you know. Menopause and perimenopause is actually our number one most requested topic by listeners. And we are going to be having a whole series of upcoming [00:28:00] episodes because question and I have been crowdsourcing recommended experts in the field. So like I've talked with, um, Jennifer Weed and Doctor Sam Graber. Um, a lot of, uh, listeners have suggested books that would be great for a book club. Questions got a whole list of experts that she's talking to. So that is, that is pretty exciting, uh, to us. And one of the things that we've loved about getting to do this podcast is [00:28:30] the opportunity to create community where women can laugh and, and be real.
Questian Telka: Yeah, absolutely. And it's like, you know, we're all in our various stages and it's just like this topic. I feel like that has been, it's just now starting. Women are just now starting to become more open about it and speak about it more openly. And it's like everyone is going to get there at some point. So even if you're not there yet, you know, I'm not there yet, but I've got to be super close [00:29:00] it. It's like you want to kind of understand, have an understanding of what's going to happen and have a community in place of women that you can talk to and learn from. So you kind of know what to expect and share information.
Nancy McClelland: Absolutely. I was so alone when I was going through my journey, and I had a doctor who didn't believe me when I said, um, you know, seems like I'm just going through really early menopause. And she said, no, you're too young to be going through menopause. [00:29:30] I was not quite 40 or just had just turned 40. And so she put me on birth control because she was like, well, if you're not having a period, then that means the lining in your uterus is building up and it needs to be shed. So she actually put me on birth control. And when I finally ended up switching doctors, she was like, you know, there's a blood test for this, right? Like we can just.
Questian Telka: Yeah. Well, you know, so something that I've learned as I've been researching [00:30:00] this and it's in, it's in a documentary that, that I, um, started watching is that most doctors receive about a month of training for menopause and that's optional. Oh, so it's like this huge thing that happens. One of the biggest changes that women have. So over 50% of the population, one of the biggest changes in their in their lives, you know, hormonally and, and medically and physically. And there's basically, [00:30:30] you know, very little training that that doctors receive. That's absolutely amazing.
Nancy McClelland: Well, speaking of community and menopause, we would love to introduce a special guest, my very, very best bestie since my first year in college, Sean Simmons. Hi, Sean. Hi there. Hi. I'm so excited that you are here on our podcast. She counts. Thank you for joining us.
Shawn Simmons: Thank you so much for having me. Um, so [00:31:00] I'm a professor of communication design, which is translates as graphic design at Milwaukee Institute of Art and design in downtown Milwaukee, which is why I'm wearing a nice warm sweater and Nancy is wearing a sleeveless shirt in her warm place. Um, so I'm a professor, but I'm also a fiber artist. I'm the person that Nancy mentioned is the poncho maker for her conferences. Um, and.
Nancy McClelland: And thank you, by the way.
Shawn Simmons: Anytime.
Nancy McClelland: Keep me warm at my conferences. Carry you with me everywhere.
Shawn Simmons: Oh, [00:31:30] um, so I'm a full time professor, and if you don't already know this, uh, professors at colleges and universities often get an opportunity to apply for something called sabbatical, which is a, um, an opportunity to take a semester or a year away from teaching and focus on a project in their field. So we had to do research. And not only does it inform our practice, many of us work in our fields as well as teach, but we also get to bring it back to the classroom. So, [00:32:00] um, I, uh, and I should also mention I'm 54, I spent about eight years before now dealing with my women's health journey and I really struggled. I had trouble finding people to talk to about it. My. I don't have family I can talk to. I don't have medical professionals in my family or, uh, ones that are very well informed as Christian was talking about. You know, it's hard to find people who, who know about this, um, very well. Uh, and I didn't have a lot of resources. [00:32:30] So I decided as I was thinking about this sabbatical project, about finding ways to use graphic design and art to help people like me to, um, to, to help people find a community and be able to talk about their experiences with menopause in particular.
Nancy McClelland: That is so creative. That is, I mean, it makes sense because, you know, here you are, you're a professor of graphic design, you're a fiber artist. Um, and you're combining those concepts to help women find community [00:33:00] around the, the menopause and perimenopause.
Shawn Simmons: I mean, that's what designers do. We see problems and we try and find solutions to them that we can, we can build on. Um, and so I applied for this, I was granted the, the award. So I had a full year. Um, we get partial pay while we're doing this. So, um, I got an opportunity to spend the first semester of this project, um, doing research. So I was doing reading and listening to podcasts and talking to people, a ton of people I interviewed some OB gyns, took a ton of classes, [00:33:30] both in, um, things about the topic, but also in fiber arts. I picked up quilting. I'm a knitter, I'm a crocheter, I weave, I spin. Um, and so I had an opportunity to really do a lot of learning. Um, and then this semester is about implementation. And the first thing I wanted to implement was a survey to find a little bit, I find out a little bit more about how women and I'm looking for people 16 and older. Um, but in particular, I'm interested in that sort of sweet spot of perimenopause and menopause. People [00:34:00] in that age range.
Nancy McClelland: I'm going to say, I think most people are going to argue that it's not a sweet spot. Nothing sweet about it.
Shawn Simmons: Someone, someone say it's very sweet. And some would say.
Nancy McClelland: It's, well, actually it's terrible.
Questian Telka: But you know what's funny about that is when I was young, I was before I had any information about what it was actually going to be like before anyone had shared it with me, I was like, I can't wait. This is going to be the best. You mean I don't have to have a period ever again? Like amazing and. [00:34:30]
Nancy McClelland: Well. So, and as we've talked about, I know both of you know, my personal experience is that that that was very much what happened to me. Um, I, you know, ended up having a completely different experience than most women did. And so I, if it weren't for the fact that my eyebrows have disappeared and I have to paint them on, I think I would be pretty much all in on this having gone through so jealous, so jealous. Yeah.
Shawn Simmons: Um, I had an interesting experience too. I called, I had to talk [00:35:00] to my insurance and my, my drug company and I talked to people. They were clearly both women. And I mentioned that I was on hormone replacement therapy and I needed to find out different options. And both of them had no idea what HRT were. And this blows.
Nancy McClelland: My mind.
Shawn Simmons: That even if you're young and your 20s and your 30s, um, the fact that you wouldn't know that that's a thing. It's been in the news a lot with the w h I, um, the women's Health initiative, um, survey from many years ago being debunked. And [00:35:30] so there's, there's a lot of people who, who are, who don't know what to expect. There are a lot of healthcare professionals, women who don't understand what it is until they go through the process themselves. So there's a lot of opportunity for us to talk about it. And I think it's it's starting to become a place in the forefront now. Um, but I'm still looking at ways that I can contribute to that. Um.
Questian Telka: So one of those ways.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah, how can we help you talk? Let's tell us about how she gets to be involved in this project, because I'm [00:36:00] super excited about it.
Shawn Simmons: And I'm very grateful for this. I have a survey that is asking people about their interaction with their communities in the past, and talking about menopause and their women's health journeys and where they might look in the future. And so I'm really looking to see where there are some holes that I can help to fill. And this survey.
Nancy McClelland: So yeah, survey I, I took it myself and it, it took me probably about seven minutes because I'm wordy. It would have just taken five [00:36:30] minutes if I were just clicking on everything. But there are spots where there's optional, you know, you can share more with me. So it is not a big time suck at all. And you're basically just trying to figure out where are your current sources of opportunities for discussing menopause and perimenopause, and where would you like to have resources that you don't already have? Resources. That's basically what you're getting at here, right?
Shawn Simmons: Absolutely. Um, [00:37:00] and so, um, uh, she counts has been so kind to create a location on their, um, their site, uh, which is she counts dot show. Um, and then if you go at the top navigation, there's a, a link to survey and that'll take you right to the Google form that just asks, I think there may be ten questions there. Um, and that'll help me think about implementation, that that survey will be open until end of day on April 1st. So if you can get to that, I just am looking for a good cross section of people to answer my questions. [00:37:30] So if you can take the time, I'd really appreciate it. Um, and now you have an opportunity to help affect how I work towards creating community around the topic. And in the meantime, I'm going to be creating artwork. I'm looking at maybe having an exhibition of my own work or a group exhibition about this topic of the women's health journey. And, and particularly I'm interested in fiber arts and how people can express their experiences through that.
Nancy McClelland: That's amazing. I'm so glad you're doing this and I'm so proud that she counts, can [00:38:00] be involved in it. So again, if you go to she counts dot show. S h o w in the upper right hand corner you'll see a tab that says survey. And if you click that it'll take you straight to this thing. Please give us five minutes of your time because it could make a lot of difference for other people in the future who kind of don't know where to have these conversations.
Shawn Simmons: Yeah, I'm really honored that Maiad offered me this, granted me this opportunity, and I'm very grateful to the two of you for letting [00:38:30] me have a voice on the show. So thanks so much.
Questian Telka: Yeah. Thanks for joining us. I'm really looking forward to hearing some of the results of the the survey later, once she's kind of gathered everything and.
Nancy McClelland: Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. You know, what would be really cool is if we have her back on the show after she's done with all of the sabbatical work, and we can hear about some of these resources and presentations and things like that.
Questian Telka: Yeah, I think that that's a great idea. So one of our favorites on [00:39:00] the list of, you know, you're a woman in accounting. When is when your significant others know exactly when it's tax or 1099 season or urine close, as do your local restaurants, delivery drivers and bartenders.
Nancy McClelland: Definitely bartenders. Yeah, that's that's key. This is my favorite section. We got the most hilarious responses from people here and I. Yeah, I have to [00:39:30] go ahead.
Questian Telka: I was going to tell you share Don's because I think Don's is my like one of my favorite crowdsource. Um, share your woman. Okay.
Nancy McClelland: Share it. Tell us who we mentioned earlier today that she was one of the, the glitter sisters or sequin sisters or whatever we were for bookkeeping, but she had an iconic entry.
Questian Telka: She did. Um, her husband, instead [00:40:00] of coming in and visiting her and saying, hey, honey, how was your day? Just appears and delivers her a gin and tonic, which.
Nancy McClelland: I mean, there is a man who understands 1099's.
Questian Telka: That's right. He understands the season. And that is definitely some marriage, uh, maturity happening there. I like those goals. Goals?
Nancy McClelland: Don, Don, you hit the jackpot. You hit the jackpot on that one. [00:40:30] Absolutely. Um, Terri Saracino said that the you know, you're a woman in accounting. If the local restaurants know when it's your tax season by the takeout volume that happens at your home.
Questian Telka: That is so funny. I wonder if, um, she's, uh, become like a big door dasher at this point. That's my guilty. That's my guilty pleasure. I'm like, okay, yeah, this time of year.
Nancy McClelland: I gotta tell you, there was one time when we ordered, [00:41:00] um, we ordered takeout pizza from our local favorite place, which is, is really near us Reno. And we went over there to pick it up and there were two little carry out like sauce containers, you know, little plastic ones with a little lid that were taped to the top of the pizza box. And each one was a shot of tequila. What? They knew it was us and they knew it was tax season. They were like, hey, that is [00:41:30] so funny. Isn't that great?
Questian Telka: Oh my gosh. Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: I love it when Terry said that. It just cracked me up. Another one that Don had mentioned and this I just thought was so funny was, um, her daughter is in dance competition and she was at an event and she was wondering why in the world is avalara that does like sales taxes and and track 1099. Um, yeah. Why [00:42:00] is Avalara sponsoring this dance competition? Because it's like keeps coming up. This ad and then she looked closely at it and it was, it wasn't avalara. It was like Ava, Ava or something like that. It was like a skin cream or something. It wasn't. But your.
Questian Telka: Brain, it's like your brain is just always in the accounting zone. It's just, why would they be sponsoring this? And it just goes on about her, her business and her thought process. Like that's odd. Yeah. [00:42:30]
Nancy McClelland: Yeah, definitely. Um, so some of mine that I got when I was talking to my mastermind, um, WhatsApp group, I had asked them for some, some thoughts and they and a few others mentioned some things that I was like, okay, that's not funny LOL. Haha that's funny. Like a little bit sad, but still. Oof! So we decided it can't be an episode [00:43:00] about, you know you're a woman in accounting. If if we don't acknowledge a few classic ones like Stephanie Stinky mentioned, um, you know, you're a woman in accounting if you're asked to tone it down during a board presentation because the board president hates women. Um, yeah.
Questian Telka: You getting louder?
Nancy McClelland: Yeah. Up the tone in that situation, she was actually really [00:43:30] she was like, turned out that was really good advice. Um, because it was true. So, uh, that was an interesting one. Yeah. Um, and there's another one that Gail Perry, who's the editor in chief of CPA practice advisor mentioned, she said that she was working for a CPA firm and one of their clients was coming into the office for a meeting, and she was the multi state expert and he had some multi-state issues. So it was natural for her to be the person who meets with him. Right?
Questian Telka: Of course. Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Well guess what? He insisted that he [00:44:00] work with a man. And so they literally set up a barrier like a screen in the conference room, and she was hiding behind it. They joked that it was like the Wizard of Oz guy behind the curtain. And she was the Wizard of Oz guy so that she could like. So she said.
Questian Telka: Oh, wait, so like he was in a conference with a man. Yes, but but the man didn't have the, the the knowledge. Yeah. So she said, oh [00:44:30] my.
Nancy McClelland: She's behind the screen listening to everything and taking notes. And so that like later on, she could actually.
Questian Telka: I would have said no.
Nancy McClelland: I was like, no, I would have said no. And I asked, I'm like, did anybody think this was okay? And she's like, at the, at the time we just thought.
Questian Telka: Yeah, it was.
Nancy McClelland: A jerk. Probably someone I don't want to know anyway. And the firm would just joke about what a jerk he was, but, um, yeah, I don't I don't think I would fly these days, I don't think.
Questian Telka: No, I hope not. I mean, I guess you don't [00:45:00] know, but I hope not. That's horrible. I can't.
Nancy McClelland: Believe amazing.
Questian Telka: Go through that. I mean, it definitely makes I, I, I mean, it's horrific, but it's also pretty funny.
Nancy McClelland: It is, it was, I had, I had to share it now Olivia.
Questian Telka: Handled.
Nancy McClelland: One, she mentioned some and Stephanie was totally agreeing with her on this, um, where they talked about, um, a topic that you covered a couple of episodes ago on [00:45:30] the way that women dress and having comments made about how you dress. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Uh, Stephanie, I think was saying that she considers her quarter zip, um, armor for when she has days that she has to meet with clients who are trying to look at her boobs. I know you cannot make this stuff up, Christian.
Questian Telka: Oh my gosh, that is so funny.
Nancy McClelland: She actually has [00:46:00] a field in her CRM. She uses canopy and she always shouts them out when, um, she, she like tags them on LinkedIn when she thanks them for this custom field where she tags problem clients. So like men who have leered at her or made passes at her. Olivia said, you know, you're a woman in accounting. If, uh, your client texts you late at night trying to sleep with you.
Questian Telka: Oh my God.
Nancy McClelland: Right.
Questian Telka: Yeah, that's that does not [00:46:30] happen to me. Thankfully, I can't.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah. Uh, it's it's it's kind of stunning. It's kind of stunning. Um, and then, uh, there was, there was maryt. She had talked about how, um, much like time and energy a woman has to put into deciding what they're going to wear. She's like, you know, you're a woman in accounting by like the amount of mental real estate that gets taken up by going, [00:47:00] oh, this looks too tight. It's funny you say.
Questian Telka: That because I was having a conversation very recently about like the amount of like, this is a great conversation, the amount of time that women have to spend to get ready for their like for work life or career. And they're expected to have a certain presentation or presence and how that amount of time that women spend doing that, [00:47:30] men get to use in order to focus on their actual work and advancing their career.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah.
Questian Telka: This was a man saying this to me.
Nancy McClelland: Oh, really?
Questian Telka: Yes.
Nancy McClelland: It's very enlightening.
Questian Telka: Yes. Yeah. That's right, yeah I know. Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: So I thought those were a couple of those were a couple of really good submissions on there. And I, I didn't want to leave them out just because they're, um, they're a little bit sad, but um, you know, they're [00:48:00] real. They're also, they're sad, but they're funny, but they're true. Right?
Questian Telka: They are. And I have, I have one, this is not a sad, funny, a sad one, but it is kind of funny. You know, you're a woman in accounting when you have to carry your laptop everywhere because you cannot read a spreadsheet on your phone. And this happens to me anytime I like have to take an appointment in the middle of the day. I'm like, I'll just carry my laptop while I sit in the waiting room or I need.
Nancy McClelland: To get a haircut.
Questian Telka: I'll bring my laptop. And so it's like, it just [00:48:30] goes with me everywhere. I suppose that's probably the case for men too, but certainly that happens. Um, that happens to me every time I try to leave the house on a work day.
Nancy McClelland: That is hilarious. Um, I have got some. You know, you're a woman in accounting. If that, uh, is way different than I'm guessing any man in accounting. And it's got some major main character energy in a really positive way to contrast, [00:49:00] um, women who were just like, oh, I'm just going to, I'm going to be me. And one of my favorites is, um, the day that I met Misty Mejia, who has become a dear friend and mentor. She runs theater of Public Speaking, which we are always talking up on the show because it's been so important to both of us. Um, I was at a conference. I was actually at a pre-conference. It was, it was the sleater con, which doesn't exist anymore, but this was back in the day and I was at the [00:49:30] pre-conference for that. And I saw Doug Sleater come into the room where I was studying whatever. I was studying with our instructor, and I had never met him in person. And so I was like, you know what? I've just always enjoyed his writing. And, you know, I would love to meet him in person. So I got up and I went to the back of the room and introduced myself. And he saw on my tag that it said the dancing accountant. And he goes, wait, are you really a dancer? And I was like, yeah, yeah, I'm a dancer. He goes, are you busy right now? And I'm like, um.
Questian Telka: Like, [00:50:00] where is this going?
Nancy McClelland: And also, I'm literally in his pre conference with an instructor. So like, obviously I was busy right now, but I was like, uh, no, I got, I've got a minute. Why? He goes, come with me. And we run down the hallway to this big room where the opening presentation, the opening keynote is going to be the next day. And there are a ton of people who are learning a choreography, [00:50:30] and Misty is teaching it to them. So she used to run Sleater con and.
Questian Telka: Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: The opening to the. The whole conference was going to be her getting up on stage and doing a keynote and then getting, quote unquote, interrupted by none other than Cindy Schroeder from bookkeeping buds who, like, gets up and starts dancing to a song. Um, happy. And so the music gets louder and louder and louder and Misty is looking around [00:51:00] just like, what's going on. And then another few people get up and start dancing, and then another few people start getting. And then we all run to the front of the room and we do this whole flashmob. I still have video of it. It was so amazing. And that is.
Questian Telka: I want to see it.
Nancy McClelland: It's it was, it was awesome. It was really great. And I love that song forever as a result of it. Well, I mean, it's a great song anyway, but I really love it because of that. So, you know, you're a woman in accounting. If you can casually pretend like your keynote [00:51:30] is getting interrupted by a flash mob that you choreographed.
Questian Telka: That's pretty impressive. I love it. This has been so much fun. I, um, I can't wait until we have this episode up. And for women to share their, you know, your woman in accounting if, um, stories. Yeah, I think that's.
Nancy McClelland: Going to be [00:52:00] that's going to be fantastic. I feel like we should have, um, um, we should have. Well, you know what? I'm gonna. There were a bunch of them that we didn't get to today that I want like our friends to share in those comments. And I think I'm going to tag Cindy Schroeder because I want her to share with us, um, how, you know, you're a woman in accounting if like you can rock the conferences and the continuing education, not only while wearing a tiara, but while handing them out to everybody [00:52:30] in your community.
Questian Telka: Oh she does. Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Yeah. So I think that that's just such an inspiration for so many people. So I'm going to tag her and be like, Cindy, give us some more.
Questian Telka: Ideas.
Nancy McClelland: About how to bring other people into our, our, our opportunity to shine and, and be a unicorn with a unicorn with a tiara on. Yeah.
Questian Telka: She just brings the she brings the happy, fun, light hearted. Be [00:53:00] yourself, you know, embrace it. Energy.
Nancy McClelland: Um, well, you know, her whole thing is she actually presented on bridging the Gap last year on the importance of bringing fun to your job. Um, and it was just a fantastic presentation. So yeah, yeah, that was.
Questian Telka: I missed that one because I think I was presenting at the same time.
Nancy McClelland: I think you might have been because I remember I had to run to three different rooms to take pictures of all of my friends presenting at the same time. Thank you. Two might have been next door [00:53:30] to marathon.
Questian Telka: Yeah.
Nancy McClelland: Oh my gosh, that conversation was so cathartic. What do you feel? Was that a good. Was that a good way to. Celebrate your birthday?
Questian Telka: Yeah, of course it was. You know, I've been wanting to kind of have a light hearted, funny one, and I feel like these these little, um, stories come up along the way and it's like, how can we, how can we come up with an idea or a way to share them with everyone and kind of laugh and vent, have some humor, commiserate all in one episode? Totally. And so like I said, as we wrap [00:54:00] up, we want to ask our listeners to follow the podcast on LinkedIn and to join on the in on the conversation by sharing under the episode, you know, you're a woman in accounting when, um, all of your funny stories about how you know, you're.
Nancy McClelland: You know, you're a women and tell me you're a woman in accounting without telling me you're a woman in accounting.
Questian Telka: Exactly.
Nancy McClelland: Before we sign off, I want to remind everyone to please fill out that survey [00:54:30] that Shawn shared with us again, go to XI dot show and in the upper right hand corner you will see a tab that says survey. It'll take you right to it. And if you have a group of women that you are on the regular with, for example, I shared this with my theater public speaking group, um, my WhatsApp and I'm going to share it in the, um, appy camp, uh, WhatsApp as well. If you're, you know, if you have a knitting club or a book club or a pickleball team or whatever, please share [00:55:00] it with them too. We want to get this out. The more data points we have, the better the solutions that are being built will be. I also want to wish question a very happy birthday again. Happy birthday, happy birthday, happy birthday, happy birthday. You're rocking 44 girl. I've got a really good quote for you today. I know we always like to to end with a quote and I wanted to pick this one out myself for you. It's by the incomparable Betty [00:55:30] White. It's your outlook on life that counts. If you take yourself lightly and don't take yourself too seriously. Pretty soon you can find the humor in our everyday lives. And sometimes it can be a lifesaver.
Questian Telka: Oh, I love that. It's always a lifesaver. I can just say that, like the humor and making light of difficult situations is what has gotten me through, uh, most of my life. So, [00:56:00] um, we want to thank everyone for being here with us on She Counts the Real Talk podcast for women in accounting.
Nancy McClelland: If something in today's episode hit home for you, well, that's exactly why we're doing this.
Questian Telka: So you feel seen, heard, and never alone.
Nancy McClelland: Remember that you can get CPE credit for listening at earmarked links to that, as well as how to learn more about our sponsors, solutions and any other resource. We got a lot of them here because we we shouted out so [00:56:30] many incredible people in the accounting industry, and I will make sure to link to all of their LinkedIn's. Those will be in the show notes.
Questian Telka: And please subscribe and leave us a review because it helps other people find the podcast podcast. Also, we would be honored if you would share with another woman in accounting who needs to hear it too.
Nancy McClelland: And for those of you who are making this last push through tax season, I see [00:57:00] you, I feel you. I'm there with you. I am in it. The struggle is real. And we will make it through and we're going to celebrate on the other side of it. We will see you in two weeks. Thanks for being here.